USS Sasser, NCC-6312 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

WIP, finished kits and other 1/1000 discussion.
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USS Sasser, NCC-6312 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by Griffworks » Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:30 pm

One of my grail designs for more than 25 years has been Thomas Sasser's take on the Indomitable-class heavy cruiser/battleship (depends on which source material you look at). He built one in 1/537 scale for a Star Trek fan club in Michigan, which had a ship named USS Superior, NCC-2020. My friend Kenneth / Cydonia was a member of that group and now has that model in his possession, tho worse for wear at the moment. You can see some of Thomas' pics on his website on the WayBack Machine - scroll down about halfway.

Anyhow, here's my 1/1000 scale version. I commissioned Ricky at MadMan ShipYards to create this for me to print. I used a Polar Lights / Round 2 Refit primary hull, a pair of Assension (sic) nacelles and Split Impulse Engine from Federation Models, and a casting of for their Abbe-class Photon Torpedo Destroyer conversion kit. I'm also going to use a casting of a photorp tube I made for the main forward tubes, which aren't represented on the model.

Ricky made the secondary hull in two halves, and the pylons for the warp nacelles are tabbed and slotted into the hull. I also requested a couple of changes to the main hull components - to make the fore and aft sections to be tabbed and slotted to make it easier on alignment, and to add a tab to the top of the "neck" area so that it's easier to align the primary hull. Ricky will incorporate those changes for me so I can purchase another two - or maybe three. I like having pieces/parts on-hand for inspirational kitbashing. Plus, I know several folks who are also planning to purchase a secondary hull or two from Ricky. Hopefully, it'll be a big seller!

On to the pics!
Superior001.JPG
Pieces/Parts!
Superior003.JPG
Superior004.JPG
Secondary hull halves assembled. I requested that Ricky make the halves keyed - one part will have a slot the other will have a tab and the two parts will align via the two "keys". I also requested that he put a tab on the neck area so that the saucer will seat directly on top of the tab and you won't have serious alignment issues there, either.
Superior008.JPG
Not the best pic, tho gives an idea of the upper surface of the secondary hull.
Superior013.JPG
Even tho the original model doesn't have standard LN-64 (Refit style) nacelles, I thought I'd give them a look-see.
Superior016.JPG
In the end, I went with the more "traditional" LN-68 Assension (sic) nacelles from Federation Models. I call them LN-68 Mod2's, as they're a bit loner and slightly different than the original design that Todd Guenther came up with all those years ago in Ships of the Starfleet, Volume One.
Superior018.JPG
The model measures out to just shy of 13.5", or 34cm in length. That scales out to 340m.
Superior021.JPG
Superior022.JPG
Not unlike the Refit, I think she's got mostly great angles with only one that I don't like - directly forward doesn't look quite as kewel as on the Refit, IMNSHO.

More to come.
Last edited by Griffworks on Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: USS Sasser, NCC-6312 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by Griffworks » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:13 pm

A few more pics.

When I went to apply the XTC-3D the other day, I discovered that I have no more paint brushes of sufficient size to actually apply the substance. My friend, Will, who recommended the product said he discovered early on that standard model-sized paint brushes just don't cut it, so recommended a smaller size that you would use for painting trim or stain on smaller areas. Well, the closest to that which we have on-hand is still too large to apply the XTC to the model, so I rant to HobbyLobby and Michaels - both are out of that size, as is Wal-Mart and the local hardware store is closed today. I'll head into the city sometime tomorrow and look again. It's just not that important at this exact moment in time to go run around just looking for paint brushes. I've got a few other items I've discovered I could use to bulk up my various hobby supplies for Wife and I, so will do that tomorrow or Thursday.

Anyhow, I've done some other work on the model last night and today.

I did seam work, mostly just along the saucer rim, the bridge and the impulse deck. I also added some gap filling CA to the gap in the join of the saucer to the secondary hull. I also fixed the resin nacelles seam mold lines.
Superior045.JPG
Superior046.JPG
First application of putty, sanded. Another coat of putty is down and curing. I also added some photoetch VIP Lounge windows from the ParaGrafix Modeling System set for the 1/1000 Refit kit.

Another thing I modified is the nacelles. I sanded down the top "tube" like area on the top of each nacelle, bringing the overall shape down about 1.5mm or thereabouts. This brings it close to keeping with the original work of the LN-68 Mod1 nacelles from "Ships of the Star Fleet, Volume One". I also sort of "rounded" the parts of the area that are normally Bussard collectors that stand up from the rest of the detail.
Superior047.JPG
Superior048.JPG
Superior049.JPG
I really like the lower profile of the nacelle tops. To me, it just looks better than having a high, narrow "hump" up there.

More later.

.
Last edited by Griffworks on Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: USS Superior, NCC-2020 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by WarpNein » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:27 pm

With that beefed up secondary hull and the more integrated neck, this looks much more like a dreadnought than the actual dreadnoughts from the period. She just needs a third nacelle. Anyway, looking forward to seeing this model develop.

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Re: USS Superior, NCC-2020 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by holt35 » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:33 pm

Great looking design Griffworks! Looking forward to this build tread and I agree 100% about the lower top section of the Assension nacelles, they look way better lowered with rounded corners like you have them.

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Re: USS Superior, NCC-2020 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by TrekMD » Thu Jul 05, 2018 1:44 am

Nice work so far.
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Re: USS Sasser, NCC-6312 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by Griffworks » Thu Jul 05, 2018 8:56 pm

WarpNein wrote:
Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:27 pm
With that beefed up secondary hull and the more integrated neck, this looks much more like a dreadnought than the actual dreadnoughts from the period. She just needs a third nacelle.

>SNIPPAGE!<
I actually kinda sorta did a dreadnought version in 1/2500 scale using an Avenger (Miranda) Thomas Models MiniMecha hull and TM MM Indomitable secondary hull, plus the "neck" and nacelle assembly of a 1/2500 VA Miniatures Jenghiz-class destroyer for the upper nacelle pylon assembly. I call it the Guenther-class dreadnought. I named it such in honor of Todd Guenther of "Starship Design" and "Ships of the StarFleet, Volume One" fame.

Image
Image
Obviously, not finished, tho I've decided construction is definitely done. I considered adding MEGA!phasers to the ship somewhere, tho can't really envision a place that really works for my personal design aesthetics. When/if I build this in 1/1000, I might look at adding another pair of tubes in the leading edge of the primary hull. To my thinking, six forward tubes would help to make up for lack of MEGA!phasers being added. That, and maybe having the primary hull shuttle bays actually act as fighter bays? I dunno. As the great Seer Yoda says "Always in motion is the future."
Anyway, looking forward to seeing this model develop.
Thanks for the comments and I'm also looking forward to it! :)
holt35 wrote:
Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:33 pm
Great looking design Griffworks!

>SNIP!<

Thanks! Tho I would like to make clear that this isn't actually my design. In essence, this is Thomas Sasser's interpretation of the Indomitable design, which was first shown in an issue of "Stardate Magazine" - an fan produced magazine of the 1980's. It looked like this:
battleship_indomitable.jpg
battleship_indomitable.jpg (40.49 KiB) Viewed 803 times
A Star Trek fan club in Michigan commissioned Thom to build an Indomitable, which they wanted named Superior. This is what he came up with:
IMG_6345.JPG
IMG_6345.JPG (21.88 KiB) Viewed 803 times
IMG_6346.JPG
IMG_6346.JPG (24.12 KiB) Viewed 803 times
This was done in 1/537 scale using the old AMT Refit kit as the base. He fabricated the secondary hull from scratch, and modified the primary hull and nacelles. He wanted to represent a ship that bridged the gap from the Refit to the Excelsior. The nacelles are meant to represent the LN-68 Mod 1 nacelles from SotSF, Vol One.

Regardless, thank you, again! I just wanted to make sure that I didn't come up with the design, but am essentially copying someone else's work.
Looking forward to this build tread and I agree 100% about the lower top section of the Assension nacelles, they look way better lowered with rounded corners like you have them.
Yeah, they've sorta bugged me since I purchased and added the first set of these on my USS Potemkin and USS Raan builds from a bit over a year ago. I've already sanding the tops of the nacelles on Potemkin and intend to do the same to the divider section on the Bussard collectors later today. I'll eventually do similar on most all of the other ships that I added those nacelles, as I want to go back and refurb most of them anyhow. I could've done a much better job on those builds than I did, so want to re-work many of them.
TrekMD wrote:
Thu Jul 05, 2018 1:44 am
Nice work so far.
Thankee, Sai!
Last edited by Griffworks on Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: USS Sasser, NCC-6312 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by Griffworks » Thu Jul 05, 2018 10:30 pm

Here are a couple of comparison pics to the Round 2 Refit - in this case my Potemkin build.
Superior041.JPG
Superior043.JPG
Superior044.JPG
Really gives you an idea of the overall size of that secondary hull, doesn't it?
Superior050.JPG
Superior051.JPG
I also added some PE to the upper aft area of each nacelle to give it a bit more detail. They're meant to be maintenance hatches of a sort. It's PE from a Tom's Modelworks 1/350 scale Fletcher Detail Set.
Last edited by Griffworks on Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: USS Superior, NCC-2020 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by WarpNein » Thu Jul 05, 2018 11:19 pm

Griffworks wrote:
Thu Jul 05, 2018 8:56 pm
WarpNein wrote:
Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:27 pm
With that beefed up secondary hull and the more integrated neck, this looks much more like a dreadnought than the actual dreadnoughts from the period. She just needs a third nacelle.

>SNIPPAGE!<
I actually kinda sorta did a dreadnought version in 1/2500 scale using an Avenger (Miranda) Thomas Models MiniMecha hull and TM MM Indomitable secondary hull, plus the "neck" and nacelle assembly of a 1/2500 VA Miniatures Jenghiz-class destroyer for the upper nacelle pylon assembly. I call it the Guenther-class dreadnought. I named it such in honor of Todd Guenther of "Starship Design" and "Ships of the StarFleet, Volume One" fame.

Image
Image
Obviously, not finished, tho I've decided construction is definitely done. I considered adding MEGA!phasers to the ship somewhere, tho can't really envision a place that really works for my personal design aesthetics. When/if I build this in 1/1000, I might look at adding another pair of tubes in the leading edge of the primary hull. To my thinking, six forward tubes would help to make up for lack of MEGA!phasers being added. That, and maybe having the primary hull shuttle bays actually act as fighter bays? I dunno. As the great Seer Yoda says "Always in motion is the future."

Thanks for the comments and I'm also looking forward to it! :)
Okay, that looks formidable. The personal aesthetics reservation is well seen. I've always thought of the largest Starfleet ships as combining the power of battleships with the allure and grandiosity of ocean liners. The Galaxy class is colossal for a ship with a thousand crewmembers. Balancing the competing military, diplomatic and exploratory roles leads to some interesting ship design choices. Some achieve a beautiful harmony, like the Refit and the Galaxy. The Sovereign is more obviously combat biased, but it still a gorgeous ship. The problem I have with the dreadnoughts has always been that they take the refit class and encrust it with extra "stuff." They read kind of like the Bozeman, where you can still see the beautiful Miranda underneath. It's also why I don't really like the Galaxy Dreadnought. I wish the additions were better integrated into the ship's lines.

That thing, however, is an unapologetic balls-out dreadnought, no compromise, no pretense. I'd buy one.

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Re: USS Sasser, NCC-6312 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by Griffworks » Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:52 pm

Superior034.JPG
No forward photorp tubes.... :(

Superior038.JPG
Now there are photorp tubes*! And it's not even Tuesday! :D





*Photon torpedoes not included with purchase of photon torpedo system in all star systems. Some exclusions applies. Cost does not include installation. Shipping charges are extra for each item purchased. Bulk purchase rates are available. Manufacturer is not responsible for mis-use of torpedoes, nor destruction, lawful or otherwise, of intended targets. Item restricted in the Galactic Empire, Terran Empire, the sunken kingdom of Lemuria, and the state of California, and may not be shipped to those locations without governmental approval. You Mileage May Vary, depending on the section of the Milky Way Galaxy you are traversing. Has been found to facilitate destruction and death when used as directed. Not known to cause cancer in rats, just incineration.

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Re: USS Superior, NCC-2020 - Indomitable-class Heavy Cruiser *PIC HEAVY*

Post by Griffworks » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:36 pm

WarpNein wrote:
Thu Jul 05, 2018 11:19 pm
Okay, that looks formidable. The personal aesthetics reservation is well seen. I've always thought of the largest Starfleet ships as combining the power of battleships with the allure and grandiosity of ocean liners. The Galaxy class is colossal for a ship with a thousand crewmembers. Balancing the competing military, diplomatic and exploratory roles leads to some interesting ship design choices. Some achieve a beautiful harmony, like the Refit and the Galaxy. The Sovereign is more obviously combat biased, but it still a gorgeous ship. The problem I have with the dreadnoughts has always been that they take the refit class and encrust it with extra "stuff." They read kind of like the Bozeman, where you can still see the beautiful Miranda underneath. It's also why I don't really like the Galaxy Dreadnought. I wish the additions were better integrated into the ship's lines.

That thing, however, is an unapologetic balls-out dreadnought, no compromise, no pretense. I'd buy one.
Thanks! That's actually what I was kinda going for - you know just lookin' at her that even if you're not on the receiving end of her wrath, you're still gonna wince and look away! :D

I'm thinking what I'll do is utilitze a "neck" from a Federation Models Heavy Destroyer conversion kit. I"ll add three photorp tubes in it, like I did in my Federation-class Dominion dreadnought.
Dominion027.JPG
The "neck" will get inverted, tho, as it will have the single topside nacelle mount to it, just above the photorp deck. That'll give Guenther five forward firing tubes. Might look at adding one aft tube on that deck, too. That would give her two aft tubes. Hmmm.... :thinking:

Thanks for the comments! :thumbsup:
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